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User Review A review of the site and any replies from other users.

Visit Ultimate Surrender

Ultimate Surrender (1)

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exotics4me (463) 09-18-07  01:33am
Rookie Badge  Talk Back  Comments  Pollster  Top Monthly User  Hardcore Badge  Trusted User  Male Profile TRUST USER?   YES (87), NO (0)
Status: Was a member approx. 1 month prior to this review.
Pros: - Dragon Lily might just be the sexiest Asian model on the planet!
- There is a strange fetish here of watching two women roll around and wrestle before having sex that makes this site very unique
- Videos are high quality, nearing HD levels and the videos are long if you watch the full match
- Some of the matches, the girls really look like they are pissed off at the other girl!
Cons: - Friggin' monthly download limit of 10 GB. I can download 10 GB in one night. 20 points taken off score for this. That is a daily limit of .3 GB
- The majority of the matches are more about girls fingering each other while the other tries to act like she doesn't like it.
- Site can get very repetitive.
- Pictures are good quality, but they are in action pictures so they add very little
Bottom Line: I didn't know there is a limit on this site. I am positive at one time, there wasn't a limit. If it was 10 GB per day or even 3 GB per day, I wouldn't take off anything, but 10 GB per month? I barely got all of the Dragon Lily matches before hitting my monthly limit. I won't be back.

As an ex-collegiate wrestler, this site really intrigued me since some of the girls look to at least know some grappling moves. The problem is a takedown nets say 10 points, while fingering for 30 seconds nets 100 points. So, there is very little real wrestling going on here. I noticed that the Asian models seem to have martial arts backgrounds and were actually quite impressive with their counters. Still, they don't get to fully show off this wrestling ability since they are trying to suck the other girl's boobs or finger her.

I am all for a woman fingering another, but it is a wrestling site. The matches are broken into rounds and the action looks to be based on these rounds. Round 2-3 will have some almost fingering and a little boob sucking, then round 4 will have the full on fingering. I did notice that some of the women really looked mad in their matches and were trying almost too hard to beat the other women.

The site leaves me torn. I can join a lesbian site if I just want to see fingering, but this does at least have some wrestling, but every match follows the same pattern.

I will use the DL limit as the make/break point that means, not recommended until they drop it!

Follow-Up:
Because kink.com removed DL Limit from this site and their other sites, I will raise the score back to where I said it would be without the limit, a 90.

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Review Replies (17)

Replies to the user review above.

Msg # User Message Date

1

SnowDude (214) I agree with most of your criticisms, but I think a 20 point drop for the dowload limit is a bit harsh. It's obviously in place to keep people from downloading their entire catalog in one night (as you said yourself). Did you contact anyone at the site about the issue? If they were ultimately non-responsive, then I'd be on your side for sure.

Regardless, I think a 20 point drop is just a bit too much, although I agree it's a problem. That's just my opinion though and you are certainly entitled to yours!

09-18-07  08:08pm

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2

exotics4me (463) REPLY TO #1 - SnowDude :

Hey SD,

Yeah, I sent them 3 emails as business etiquette would say to stop after 3 without replies. Also notice the price difference. I am almost positive it used to be $21.95 per month, it is now $29.95. The newest Dragon Lily match is a total of 600 MB, at that rate, I would only get 15 matches before hitting the DL limit. I had to go back and check the DL limit because I thought it was 10 GB per day, but this is 10 GB per month. If you break it down, you can only download half of a match per night for the 30 days. That just seemed unfair to me. I usually won't even complain about 1 GB per day limits, but 0.3 GB limit per day for $30 a month is crazy.

Last, maybe you thought it was a daily limit since you mention the downloading everything in a night part. Like with Mike in Brazil's site, it is 1 GB per day so everyone doesn't download all of the content in one night. I can understand that for a few reasons, including stress on servers. But I will be waiting for the Ultimate Surrender staff to explain how making someone download only 10 GB in 30 days is helping them, except for the reason I believe, to make the members have to stay an extra month or two to get all the content.

No offense taken at all. I believe the site has fell into new hands that are running it, seeing the price change and DL limit.

09-19-07  12:21am

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3

SnowDude (214) REPLY TO #2 - exotics4me :

Hmmm....oooooooooo-k...I officially take back everything I said. Damn that sucks and makes absolutely no sense. What the heck are they thinking?
09-19-07  10:59am

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4

exotics4me (463) REPLY TO #3 - SnowDude :

Hey SD, I agree. One thing to check out sometime, all of their sites under the "Kink" company name, including fuckingmachines have all went up in price and all now have the 10 GB per month DL limit. As crazy as this sounds, it is possible for a person on telephone line internet to download 10 GB in a month! It has to be a move of greed. If I were them, I would package 2-3 of their sites together and maybe put a premium price on it, say $40 a month. If I was that desparate for money. I had joined fuckingmachines 4 times in the past 2 years, but now they have lost me on that site too with a 10 GB monthly DL limit.

Makes me appreciate some of these other sites a lot more too!

09-23-07  02:32pm

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5

asmith12 (124) Can't agree that 10GB/month is a really bad thing; ok, I can reach downloading speed of 10GB/day too, but when I will watch all that stuff (10GB is more than 20hours of video @ pretty decent 1Mbit/s, so I won't get any life besides watching porn, not even enough sleep)?

Also according to poll on Aug 9, most of the site visitors (84%) spend 1-2 hours/day or less watching Internet porn (definition is a bit vague, but most likely it also covers previously downloaded porn), which essentially means that vast majority of this site visitors most likely won't really care about this kind of limit; as the idea of the site is to make reviews useful for others, punishing site that bad for a thing which doesn't really matter for most site visitors is just plain wrong IMHO.

10-19-07  10:00am

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6

exotics4me (463) REPLY TO #5 - asmith12 :

I don't get it. First, I write reviews to give my opinion. If I pay for 30 days, I better have access for those 30 days, especially when it is not advertised on their site when I joined. Since you took the long term look at the site, take a short term look instead.

On average I can download 333 MB a day which would equal 10 GB in a month. 333 MB is not one FULL episode. So what, I watch one part one day, the next part the next day? You're being unrealistic. Nobody said anything about being able to watch all of it. I just want my money's worth. I can go on countless sites for less than $30 a month and get unlimited movies.

Let me put it this way, I will never join Ultimate Surrender again, and my score for the site shows that feeling. As for 84% watching 1-2 hours per day. First, that is maybe 20 people, there are millions of people who watch porn. Second, you think because 84% of a couple of dozen people says something that means it would be that way if we asked say, 1,000,000 people?

Tell you what ask anyone, "If you pay for your power bill by the month, how many days do you expect to get power?" There you go. No trust because we have different opinions? You must have quite the ego to believe your opinion is better than someone else's. You're not criticizing my actual review, which are some of the most in-depth on the site, just my opinion on a number that we all different ideas of what that score means. You can also look at the replies between myself and Snowdude and how once explained he thought the DL limit sounded crazy too. Send a poll into the site and ask what is thought of a 10 GB monthly limit, you might be surprised at the results.

10-19-07  11:19am

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7

asmith12 (124) REPLY TO #6 - exotics4me :

> First, I write reviews to give my opinion.
Sure. And I write replies to give my opinion.

So to re-iterate my opinion: I strongly disagree with a concept to get all you can, whether you really need it or not (which you seem to imply in "Nobody said anything about being able to watch all of it. I just want my money's worth. ").

As for your analogy with power bill - I think it is fundamentally flawed. I'd say that downloading the stuff you cannot possibly watch is much more similar to coming to all-you-can-eat buffet and taking all the food you can put on all the plates you can find (but not being able to eat it, which means that they'll need to throw it away); while I've never seen such a thing in real life, I'd expect that somebody doing it most likely will be moved away, and most likely with no refund.

The only potentially valid point you IMHO have is that they should tell about it in advance; but are you sure that you've read their Terms and conditions carefully enough? (sorry, but I'm way too lazy to do it).

About the poll - I've already suggested a poll asking how much people download per month (and those who download less than 10G, shouldn't care about the limit).

As for the 'No' trust - yes, I do think that your reviews are useless for me as they're based on criteria which as I think are completely irrelevant, so yes, I don't trust your reviews, and won't take into account your ratings when choosing the site; it is my opinion and I don't see why I shouldn't tell about it; that's what 'No' trust is for, isn't it?

10-19-07  11:40am

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8

exotics4me (463) REPLY TO #7 - asmith12 :

Good grief, my comparison is flawed though it is based on a monthly bill, yours is based on a one time visit. Think you might better rebuild that one so that it is based on a monthly payment like the site is. And no, if I go to an all you can eat restaurant, that means no limits. Restaurants that have limits say, "All you can eat on one plate" this site didn't tell of that limit.

I tested something today, you mentioned 1-2 hours being the typical porn usage by the members in a poll on here. I will take the middle at 1 1/2 hours and say I downloaded 4 GB from Videobox in 1 1/2 hour yesterday. 4 GB per day for 30 days is 120 GB, the limit is 10 GB. Even if it was 30 minutes of downloading per day, I would get over 1 GB, which is 30 GB per month, still triple the limit. At my download speed, I can download for 10 minutes per day on this site for $30 a month. That is a rip off.

I tried to contact the site 3 times as explained in my discussion with SnowDude. I posted a comment asking the other members if they had a problem with a limit, which tells you the hassle I went through trying to find out about the limit.

On the trust rating, ask yourself this, did I post anything false in the review? All the information about the content, quality of, was true. So what is not to trust? A number? There is no laid groundwork on here for how to grade a site. Most of the members have said on here that they don't just read the score, since we all vary on our opinions. Most posted they are looking for facts about the site, amount and quality of content. If you are basing joining a site on someone else's score, you are going to be in trouble. For example, I'm not an anal sex fan. If I were to review an anal sex site, the score would be lower even if the quality was excellent, because I didn't enjoy it. An anal fan could then say, "Excellent amount of content and quality" without looking at the score.

Last, notice that I listed how much I dropped for the DL limit, now if someone reads it who doesn't mind the DL limit, they can in their head add those points back, right? It just comes off as you loving this site and not liking my low score of it. Everything you complained about has been answered in this post.

10-20-07  03:35am

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9

asmith12 (124) REPLY TO #8 - exotics4me :

> my comparison is flawed though it is based on a monthly bill
Nope. Your analogy is fundamentally flawed because (as I strongly suspect) you're paying your power bill according to power usage, not at a flat rate. Do you really think any site would bother with DL limits if they could charge you per-megabyte downloaded (similar to power companies charging per-kW-h)? Come on.

About your test - it is completely irrelevant; as I've said before, it is not about amount you can _download_ in that hours, it is about amount of video you can _watch_ within these hours. According to my calculations, at 1MBit/s amount you can watch in 1.5*30=45 hours is about 20G, which is still higher than 10G limit, but as I really doubt somebody spends all his 'porn' time just watching videos from single site, in practice it shouldn't be a substantial limitation for most users. Still, all of these are just speculations; let's wait and see whether a poll I've submitted ("How much porn do you download per month?") is accepted and then see the results.

> On the trust rating, ask yourself this, did I post anything false in > the review? All the information about the content, quality of, was
> true.
> So what is not to trust? A number?
Exactly. As I've seen other trust ratings, it is pretty common on this site to put 'no' trust rating for people because they're (as the person who sets rating thinks) are consistently inflating or deflating their ratings, despite that nobody questioned information provided or honesty of reviewer; as I understand it, the same logic should apply perfectly to the case when reviewer consistently applies wrong (as I think) criteria to his/her reviews.

10-20-07  04:23am

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10

exotics4me (463) REPLY TO #9 - asmith12 :

I checked that August 9th poll, the question was, "On Average, how much time do you spend surfing porn on the internet daily?" Surfing being the key word, surfing means, "browsing" it has nothing to do with watching movies. "Surfing the internet" as defined by the Slang Dictionary means, "Using a web browser to search through the many home pages that make up the world wide web - also used to describe searching through the Internet as a whole."

As for you, I already told you, you are not a voice for the millions of internet users who can say "It is about how much you can watch". First and foremost, I consider myself a porn collector, I have favorite models, who I collect movies and pictures of. So a download limit can hamper the way I use porn. Your way is not the only way, as I told you before.

I hate to break it to you, but my estimation is that the very average porn fan downloads 1 GB per day, on average. The majority of HD clips that are coming out now are in the 750 mb to 1 GB range per CLIP. A full HD DVD will be in the range of 4 GB.

Look at other sites on here that have DL Limits, try Pier 999, where a couple of members have already complained about a 3 GB per day limit, that is 90 GB per month. A few have mentioned the 10 GB per DAY limit on Evelyn's World and one even mentioned an unknown DL limit that Twistys has that has to be in excess of 10 GB per day.

I'm not here to argue, but you made sure to draw my attention to this comment, and the funniest part of all, you criticize my score of this site, even though TBP, the parent site of Porn Users, has it rated closer to my score than yours. Their score is a 78, 8 points above mine, 12 points below yours. Even worse is that Duke of TBP has this site rated a 74, yet you are making it look like I'm the only person who has a problem with this site.

Last, I had more complaints with this site than just the DL limit, I ran out of room at the end and couldn't explain it all, though most of it was mentioned. The wrestling is 100% staged. If not, the parts wouldn't go in the exact same order. First round clothed, second round topless, and so on. Second, the movies are not downloadable in full parts which is a big complaint of mine on any review of a site that uses split clips. I also mentioned the repetitive nature of the site and the way the videos are almost all the same, nothing original after watching one match. Last and the deal killer was the DL limit and high price, which is nearly 33% higher than 6 months ago. Those are all very valid complaints. Not to mention, a 70 isn't a terrible score. If you're going to knock others for using wrong criteria, I would check on my own if I were you, seeing that your score is much higher than TBP's. I won't reply again, so you can reply if you want, if not, that is just as well.

10-21-07  12:42am

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11

asmith12 (124) REPLY TO #10 - exotics4me :

About poll on Aug 9 - as there wasn't more relevant poll one at the time, I've used this one. Let's wait for results of poll I've suggested if it ever comes.

> you are not a voice for the millions of internet users
I'm definitely not, and you're not too BTW. All I write is my opinion only, and I am really surprised the lengths you are going to to make me change it. I've made my point (the one that I strongly disagree with paying that much attention to this kind of criteria) and made it clear to others, that's what this whole site is about, or it isn't? Therefore, I don't see that much to discuss here.

> I ran out of room at the end and couldn't explain it all
Cannot help to say that for me it sounds way too close to infamous "My dog ate my homework" :-).

10-21-07  01:08am

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12

badandy400 (103) I have to agree that download limits are a terrible thing! I am extremely critical of sites that use them. I can understand sites using them to certain extents, but there is a limit to which they should be used. I have downloaded videos at more than 1 GB per part, just as Exotics said. Having low download limits is just a sneaky method of getting people to have to pay for multiple months and possibly forget about their membership and end up charged hundreds of dollars before realizing. Either that or they are trying to avoid buying more bandwidth, or both for that matter.

I will mention though that I did not have any issue with download limits a few months ago though, but that does not mean they are not there. Anything Eroitics says about a site should be taken seriously, after all he is the highest user here!

03-18-08  05:43pm

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13

exotics4me (463) REPLY TO #12 - badandy400 :

Hey badandy400, thanks for the reply, because of all the complaints, I guess here on PU and from regular customers, this site (Ultimate Surrender) and all others owned by kink.com, have dropped their DL limits. Which at least lets us know that our voices are being heard here at PU! I need to change my score for this site since they fixed that limit. Thanks again.
03-23-08  10:35pm

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14

badandy400 (103) REPLY TO #13 - exotics4me :

I am glad we can all do our part to make the porn world better for everyone!
03-24-08  05:18pm

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15

Davit (46) REPLY TO #13 - exotics4me :

Just been reading through your unpleasant argument with asmith12 - let me add my support to your side! You gave your own opinion, based on verifiable facts, and so don't deserve to be 'mistrusted' based on that!

I found asmith's arguments ludicrous - comparing unlimited downloading to 'filling up a plate with food, then having to leave it to be thrown away'. Jeez, talk about tenuous. Downloads aren't perishables! They are there to be saved and accessed at ones leisure!

Keep up the good and honest reviews my friend. :)

06-21-08  05:21pm

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16

exotics4me (463) REPLY TO #15 - Davit :

Hey Davit,

Yeah, that was a pretty ugly argument that I finally just gave up on. I don't know what was going on with asmith at that time, he seems to be a good member these days. I don't know if it was one of those moments where he tried to make himself better known by refuting an established member or what. Either way, his view never changed towards my reviews, even after I wrote the follow-up and gave the points back since the DL limit was lifted on Ultimate Surrender.

I do notice that our comments are read on here by sites. Less than a month after my review of US, they lifted the DL limit and less than a week after my comment on Viv Thomas's video site not letting Teen Dreams members download his content as bonus content, but only letting them stream it, he has gone back and started letting the Teen Dreams members download his movies, though they are only 750 bitrate, compared to 2000 on his site.

Thanks for the support on this one!

06-22-08  03:54am

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17

Davit (46) REPLY TO #16 - exotics4me :

Well, you're not the only one my friend. I had to deal with some seriously childish arguments from the webmaster of 1 by Day after I gave some constructive criticism that he couldn't handle (even accused me of being a plant from another porn site, because of course no one could possibly genuinely dislike his site) - but happily I got LOTS of support from fellow PUs (even those that disagreed with my points) and he showed himself up for the petty little man he was.
I agree - we can make a difference!
Regards
Davit

06-25-08  01:37pm

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